On Christmas Eve, someone suggested that it might be useful to have a full transcript of a certain part of Stephen Bannon’s interview with the late Andrew Breitbart, from the December 11, 2011,“Victory Sessions” podcast.
This is that transcript.
(Hat tip The Other McCain )
Bannon: Andrew, let’s shift topics. We’ve got a couple minutes left in this segment. I know you gotta jump. But I want to go to, besides your website, the resignation of GOProud wasn’t big enough news.
Glenn Beck made a very disturbing comment on an analysis he was doing of Newt Gingrich versus President Obama. Can you walk people through what Glenn Beck said, and then what I believe you posted last night on your website?
Breitbart: He was on Judge Napolitano’s show on Fox, and the self-appointed historian of the conservative movement, an autodidact who’s read a lot of books over the last few years, decided to impart his assessment of Newt Gingrich: that he was a progressive, that he cited Teddy Roosevelt as a progressive– Gingrich, that is– and that Gingrich’s actions and attitudes towards government and appreciation of Teddy Roosevelt means that Newt Gingrich is a progressive just like Barack Obama. And so Barack Obama is a progressive and Newt Gingrich is a progressive, yet the Tea Party is going to side with a progressive in Newt Gingrich. Then he can see the only reason why they would side with Newt Gingrich over Barack Obama is because of the issue of race. He played the race card–
Bannon: You’re saying that he actually was a race-baiter. He said that if you look at what these two guys stand for, they’re both big government-progressives. Ergo, if you like Gingrich, as a Republican or a conservative, it must be because of the color of his skin.
Breitbart: Well, that’s exactly what he said, and Judge Napolitano– there are a lot of Beck supporters, In the past, Beck has made a lot of mistakes and his supporters come out and try to defend him, because Beck is a coward and will not defend himself when he makes a mistake or lies about a person or steals content–
Bannon: Hold on, I want to go back over this: you’re saying that Glenn Beck’s a coward, Glenn Beck’s a liar, and you’re saying that Glenn Beck steals material from people?
Breitbart: Oh yes, and this is well-documented. And whenever he does it, he never answers to the charges. He’s a coward. He won’t have me on the radio show, he won’t have himself [and] me on GBTV, refused to have me on Fox when he threw me under the bus. During the Sherrod thing, I asked to be on tv or radio to explain why he had it wrong. Months later, we found out why he wouldn’t have me on is because he lied to his audience on television that he didn’t do the Sherrod story. In fact, on his radio show he attacked Shirley Sherrod, took the two-minute-thirty-second video we had on Breitbart.tv and Big Government, and he cut it into 15-second clips. And he attacked her throughout the morning. So when he went on tv, he later found out– had he read my article, he would have seen that I wrote, “Eventually, her basic humanity informed her to help the white farmer,” and that this article was about the NAACP. But he jumped the gun, and in essence jumped the shark, and attacked her mercilessly. In order to rectify the situation, he went on tv and tried to pretend like he was above the fray and told O’Reilly, to his face, a lie: that he had the prescience to see the video and realize that there was a context missing, and therefore he avoided the pitfall and didn’t do the story. We later found out in our investigation– because we’re being sued by Shirley Sherrod– that Glenn Beck eviscerated her and in fact selectively-edited the audio in the 15-second clips to make it appear what he wanted it to appear like. And we called him on it, and he will not answer to it.
He also has historically been found to take countless bloggers’ content, to turn it into book gold, to turn it into chalkboard gold, his infamous chalkboards. Much of them were taken from websites like Big Government, Verum Serum… Matthew Boyle at the Daily Caller chronicled dozens of examples of him taking stuff without credit. He will not answer to the charges, and his minions online like to defend him. And in the case of this one, Glenn Beck, they’re trying to say that he was being facetious when he said that the Tea Party is racist, or the Tea Party must be driven by race considerations in supporting Newt Gingrich.
Bannon: Let me ask you something: you have been, of all the stuff you’ve been a warrior about– and I go all around the country and I see you all the time, I’ve had a chance to film you. No one is more at the heart of this issue, the whole issue of calling people racist, of racism and the Tea Party, the Congressional Black Caucus. You’ve been there, you’ve taken many arrows. Tell me, how did this thing strike you? I was shocked when I saw it, but you have been at the tip of the spear in this fight.
Breitbart: Well, Napolitano took it literally. If this was meant to be facetious or comical or making a rhetorical point… When Napolitano took it literally, Beck did not clarify the situation. Of course, I’ve been at the forefront– and Glenn Beck knows it– of trying to defend the Tea Party against the charges of racism. You know Glenn Beck has been trying to run away from the Tea Party and take– and create more of an evangelical kind of movement, based upon a faction of the Tea Party. But I’ve been out there, trying to defend the Tea Party: at its core, a bunch of patriotic citizens who want a return towards fiscal sanity in this country and a return to constitutional values. And it was predictable that the Organized Left would attack the Tea Party falsely based on racism. But to find that there would be people on the Right that would indulge that and push that meme for their own, you know, business purposes, in order to drum up controversy, in order to try and get attention to GBTV now that he’s no longer on Fox News. It’s just grossly cynical.
Bannon: Do you think, where do you think this story goes? It’s up on the website now. You’ve had a volley that I think went out last night, it’s up on the Breitbart site. My guess is Andrew Breitbart. Where does this go? I mean, what do you want Glenn Beck to do, or where do you think this goes?
Breitbart: At this point, I don’t care what he does because he’s dead to me. He jumped the shark a long time ago. There are people in the movement I’ve had rifts with, and there’s nothing I’d like more than to heal those rifts. But I was warned about Glenn Beck by my intellectual betters, people who have a lot more power than me in the conservative movement, and I didn’t heed their advice. And I had exactly happen to me what they warned would happen, and it’s happened so many times.
I think he’s a clever guy. He’s a clever guy, and I know that while he was throwing me under the bus he was simultaneously using his guys that work for him to go try and take away editors and writers that worked for me and to demean me in the process. While he was doing this, he was weirdly– on the air– say, “Oh, Breitbart, he’s valiant. Breitbart, he’s heroic,” making it so that the audience would say, “Well, Glenn only says nice things about Andrew on the air,” while simultaneously was sending his radio agents, you know, people in his radio network and trying to get my editors in order to create a competitor website over at The Blaze and GBTV.
So, he’s a snake. Everybody in the business knows that he’s a snake, and he won’t confront me on that. He can’t rectify the situation with me. He’s going to have to figure out a way to rectify things with anyone who takes my word, and finds themselves a supporter of him as well.
Bannon: And the Tea Party. This does not just… my concern is just that this does not advance the football. I thought that we had put this in back of us. We had put this in back of us nine month ago. You had done such a tremendous job and really taken so many of the hits. We were going onto a new election cycle, and this was kind of, you know, put in back of us. We had, everybody had moved on. You had proven that the Tea Party was not racist, this is going to bring up a whole new kettle of fish and it’s just unfortunate–
Breitbart: I went to him and I said, “These people have charged the Tea Party with racism, and that the ‘N’ word was hurled at Congressmen Carson and Lewis. And I found four video, four “Zapruder” videos, from four different angles, that shows that the incident didn’t happen against them the way that they said. He wouldn’t put that up, as well. So he wanted the Tea Party to be guilty as charged.
I don’t know what to say, because it makes me look like a bad guy. I mean, I know there’s Reagan’s 11th Commandment. How many times can you have a baseball bat taken to your ribcage by a gang that has “GB” on their jerseys before you stand up for yourself?
Bannon: Listen, can people go to Breitbart[.com] and see the Judge Napolitano piece? Because you are saying in studio, Judge Napolitano did not take this as a joke. He did not take this as a euphemism. He took this as deadly serious, correct? When Beck went through his analysis of, and we are talking about Glenn Beck’s analysis of Newt Gingrich and President Obama. People can go to your website and see that video. Has that been pulled down yet?
Breitbart: No. It’s at BigGovernment.com and it’s at Breitbart.tv. You can see it for what it is. But it’s a continuum, this isn’t a singular act. If this were a singular act, I would have said, “Maybe he was being rhetorical.” It doesn’t seem that he is, but this guy has always been about himself. You know, while you are sitting there watching him talk about the Food Storage stuff. He doesn’t tell you that this has ties to the Mormon Church. He doesn’t talk to you– he doesn’t tell you about his investors. He doesn’t tell you that they are paying for him to create a crisis. You know he always talks about Cloward-Piven and how Rahm Emanuel said, “Don’t let a good crisis go to waste.” By creating a hysteria that there’s going to be these food storages because of chaos that’s coming. I mean he’s profiting from this as well. You know, there’s a financial stake in him, with food storage companies that are advertising on his site. This guy is a huckster, he’s always been a huckster.
It’s only a few years ago that he was a shock jock, and that he was a “Morning Zoo” guy. He’s been taking people’s content for years and not crediting it. He tripped into the vast right-wing conspiracy, and that’s where he had his greatest successes. So he said, “Okay I’m a radio show host, and now I’m a popular television show host. I’m gonna become a book author, I’m gonna become everything. Now I’m going to become a web impresario.”
How do you do that? How do you create the New York Times from scratch? How do you– well, in his mind, it was take Breitbart stuff and don’t credit it and simultaneously try to destroy him and his reputation by throwing him under the bus on Sherrod. And then a month later, create a replica website using people that he’s hired away from Breitbart’s site. And then not let Andrew Breitbart defend himself when you are throwing him under the bus. This is what it is. I’m sorry to be raising these things. But it’s just the flat-out reality, as people are pushing, you know, giving their hard-earned cash to him, to GBT[V] every month. Now that he’s asking for money from people in a trying time, where people should be collecting their nuts and their dried fruit and their, store things. If things are that bad, I’m telling you there are better places to put your money than GBTV.
Bannon: My guest has been Andrew Breitbart. This is the beginning of, I think, a big one. Big weekend for you. One on GOProud, the other on Glenn Beck. Go to Breitbart.com, go to Breitbart.tv, go to any of the Bigs: Big Government, Big Journalism; this story is only, I think, going to get bigger. Andrew, thank you very much for sharing. I realize that this comes from your heart. You’re a guy that many, many, many people in the conservative movement admire. And you’ve stood up, whether it was for the Tea Party against the racism charges, or for the GOProud guys when they got the boot from CPAC. You are a guy that has people’s backs, so I think that’s why people put a ton of credibility in what you have to say. And when you are clearly worked up on something, people pay attention.
Breitbart: Well, thanks a lot, Steve.
EDIT.1: Appreciate the linkage, The Other McCain!